tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15644559.post1675230599914365738..comments2023-11-05T01:11:04.903-08:00Comments on Omniorthogonal: Submissionmtravenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02356162954308418556noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15644559.post-56403361189817510372010-09-01T13:41:28.972-07:002010-09-01T13:41:28.972-07:00I've never been to a Muslim service, but in ge...I've never been to a Muslim service, but in general the religion seems to me to be a lot more similar to Catholicism than Judaism. Something about the submission, the bowing, the kneeling, etc. seems similar, and perhaps related to the medieval origins of both. Of course, Islam is very different and lacks Catholicism's essential infantilization (why are priests called "Father"?) and general mode of dark-ages hopelessness.<br /><br />I noted at a very young age-- probably while attending a friend's Bar Mitzvah service-- that religions definitely each have their own unique flavor, and also feel to to me to be set in (or stuck in) a particular historical time and geographic place.<br /><br />My first time attending Jewish services gave me a very powerful sensation of stepping into the Bronze Age-- the earilest days of western civilization. The language, the customs, the traditions, have been remarkably well-preserved for so many thousands of years. It felt alien to me, but fascinating. The very strong intellectual-- even argumentative-- aspect of it always appealed to me, though, being a geek. I guess that's not too surprising from a people who have had a 100% literacy rate since the Bronze Age, as compared to most cultures which have had a literacy rate of like 1% or something during most of history. Having grown up in the Catholic church, so the closest cousin I found to that is in Jesuit tradition.<br /><br />But it took many years after finding my own Daoist/Discordian faith and saying far away from my parents religion, to finally get the same kind of alien/fascinating sensation from a Catholic mass, and it was a very odd sensation indeed. I definitely got a strong but momentary sense of threat and danger, but also of grief and sadness, like visiting a cemetary. It felt so MEDIEVAL to me, like stepping into France in the 12th century CE. Somber, depressing, morbid, with the stench of plague victims ("Bring out your dead! Bring out your dead!") almost palpable. And it wasn't even a Latin mass.<br /><br />I suppose that as long as people don't take any of this stuff too seriously, it's all good. In any case, the violent extremism is really the problem, and every religion has it.<br /><br />I still find it useful to remember that the most deadly terrorists on earth are Hindus-- the Tamil Tigers of Sri Lanka-- the same religion as Gandhi.goatchowdernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15644559.post-90613759491602136802010-09-01T04:59:49.764-07:002010-09-01T04:59:49.764-07:00I certainly know nothing, but Stephen Prothero'...I certainly know nothing, but Stephen Prothero's simple enumeration of the different <a href="http://enthusiasm.cozy.org/archives/2010/04/problemsolution" rel="nofollow">problem/solution</a> of various religions seems helpful here.<br /><br />What he say: pride and exile are the top issue for islam or judism respectively. Both are pretty widespread tough and interesting problems. He say: that the goto solutions "submission" and "return to god" - respectively.<br /><br />I spent a lot of time, after learning of Prothero's framework trying to think about what it means to deeply deeply worry about each of the problems on the list. A sort exercise of the of walk in those painful shoes kind. It is curious how little time members of one religion spend worried about the core problem of another. Christians devote very little time to worry about pride or exile; sometimes even prescribing them as part of a treatment for their concern - e.g. sin.exuberancehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180872922559635562noreply@blogger.com